People Like Us

People Like Us

[ed – Reblogged from user “Whisper” at Reddit’s RedPillWomen]

Whisper @ Reddit RedPillWomen

“Is it really just a cover up used by abusive dominant men who enjoy smacking their lady around?”

From what I’ve read of the subject, relationships of this kind are often suggested by the submissive, rather than the dominant partner.

dominant_submissive_coupleI remember in particular reading the firsthand tale of one woman buying a book on this in secret, spending weeks mustering the nerve to present it to her husband, and immediately rushing out of the room in embarrassed tears after doing so, to hide in the bedroom and bury her face in a pillow.

Does that sound like an excuse for abuse to you?

Perhaps most people don’t realize just how damn many women are into this on some level. Once you learn to spot this, it’s all over the place, and there’d be a lot more of it still if there weren’t so many of those women ashamed and thinking they are the only one, or curious about it and scared to try. Seriously, some of you reading this (and I know there are some of you), you are not alone. If you have sexual fantasies about your man taking charge in the bedroom and being rough and forceful with you, you are in the majority. If your fantasies are more specific, about being tied up or spanked, or dominated by a controlling man, or if you have ever had a fantasy about being raped, then you may not be quite the majority, but there’s a lot of you. Certainly more numerous than the gays.

Among those with these urges, it’s not uncommon to find emotional fulfillment and satisfaction in moving that dynamic of control beyond the confines of the bedroom. It’s not always merely a sexual turn on.

Whisper @ Reddit RedPillWomen

“I was under the impression that taking it outside the bedroom was pretty rare? Do you have more information on how common it is?”

I don’t have statistics, but in my personal experience with a good many submissive women, there are three dynamics:

– The “bedroom-only” submissive. Wants to be spanked during sexytimes, doesn’t like males having power over her when she has her clothes on. Rarest.

– The slave. Wants to be the property of her man, to trust and obey him absolutely in everything. Uncommon, but less rare than the first type.

-The subservient woman. Somewhere in between these two. Turned on by BDSM during sexytimes, finds emotional satisfaction from the dominance of trusted male authority outside the bedroom. Has limits to what she will comply with, and needs to be able to trust before obeying, but craves fulfillment of those conditions, because that dynamic makes her truly happy. Most common.

dom_sub_white_coupleThe reason most people think that moving it outside the bedroom is rare is that only the second category is publicized as such. But a woman doesn’t have to wear a locking collar to enjoy giving up some power in her daily life.

The third category is a sort of silent majority of submissive women, kept silent by the public shame inflicted by feminists and feminist-influenced culture should they dare to speak out. The first category escapes this shaming by having an easier time staying in the closet, and because they are at least marginally acceptable to all but the most extreme of feminists should they choose to out themselves. The second category, while they certainly dare not out themselves to their families or professional colleagues, are generally far beyond caring what feminists think.

It is the third category of submissive woman who is hit hardest by the taboo against female submission in relationships. She is hit even harder than the sort of men whose attention she craves, for while we are certainly subject to character assassination, slander, and aspersions that we are “misogynists”, “sociopaths”, or “sick perverts” one short step from serial murder, our dominant preferences at least allow us to feel comfortable ignoring a great deal of ignorant hate.

A submissive woman, by her very nature, is keenly inclined to suffer (and not in a fun, sexy way) when criticized by the public (or loudmouthed feminist talking heads) for being who she is. And yet being submissive is no more a choice for her than being heterosexual (or not). The more submissive she is, the more she suffers from being held unacceptable by the “matriarchy”.

This category includes, in my experience, a great many women, perhaps even a majority. Those who doubt me should go read a romance novel.

“I’m not really submissive or subservient to “men” in general, but rather to my partner in particular.”

Duh.

Any submissive woman is going to pick a particular man to obey. Even women who are slaves are slaves to a particular man as their master.

However, you are subservient (I use term to distinguish this from submissiveness in the bedroom-only sense) to a particular man because you want a man to be subservient to, and he’s the one you like best.

If he got hit by a bus, you wouldn’t suddenly lose your submissive tendencies. You would grieve for a time, pick up the pieces, find another man, and be subservient to him.

tumblr_ml4j18oWqD1sntzj6o1_500Your obedience is not an artifact of this relationship alone, but of your nature. If you’re not serving a man, it’s because you can’t find one you’re comfortable serving… and you’re going to wish you could, and probably be looking for one.

I must, however, confess to some puzzlement as to why any woman who likes and trusts men enough to submit to one of them would describe herself as a [feminist, a] member of what is essentially an anti-male interest group.

Talking HeadsPeople Like Us

He said be proud of what you are
There’s something special ’bout people like us
People like us
Gonna make it because
We don’t want freedom
We don’t want justice
We just want someone to love.

audrey-deal

26 thoughts on “People Like Us

  1. Nice post. I hope you weren’t suggesting by linking my article that I condone “ignorant hate”.

    I appreciate that you are advocating the acceptance of many women’s sexual desires. Hopefully a day will come when people are not judged for such preferences.

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    1. ^Response
      In my post I acknowledge-more than once-that submissive women (who wish to be predominantly submissive in most or all of life’s aspects) exist. That particular post was directed toward people (mostly those of the pick-up artist variety) who claim that all women are sexually submissive all the time.

      I meant to explain an otherwise “vanilla” person’s “submissive” (and “dominant”) fantasies-that is, women who, most of the time, do not wish to be dominated. It was not at all my intention to suggest that submissive-by-nature women are weird or wrong, just to clarify that *non* submissive women can have a submissive fantasy. Claiming otherwise would be like saying that men who are turned on by the idea of an older woman “teaching them the ropes” always want to be submissive.

      Again, it was not at all my intent to “out-explain” or minimize submissives, just an attempt to explain the submissive fantasies of non-submissives.

      If that’s not what you meant, sorry. I just wanted to clarify.

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      1. It might be easier for you to understand if you think of it as a “tendency” as opposed to a “type” or “class.” It’s not that women are “submissive” or “not submissive.” It’s that women tend to have submissive tendencies.

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    2. No I don’t consider your article “hate” but I have to say it comes across as trying to “explain away” women’s submissiveness with rhetoric about “society” and “low self esteem” as if first, it’s a problem, and second, and if it’s somehow artificial as opposed to biological.

      Also, you’re just plain wrong that “society” deems it acceptable to have fantasies about “ravishing” women. Have you ever read a feminist? Also, that men have ravishment fantasies as often as women, just “society” keeps them from expressing them, is also wrong. Men and women aren’t the same, despite what feminism says. Remember, feminism is an ideology, like communism, or libertarianism. It’s not fact, it’s not science.

      I’ve never heard anyone, at any time, ever, say that “all women are submissive.” That’s like Feminist Strawmen 101.

      Your article is basically sub-shaming, although not as nasty as something that, say, Dworkin would write.

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      1. Again, I wasn’t targeting women who enjoy the submissive lifestyle *at all*. I was targeting those who think it’s impossible for women to not want submission in one aspect, but want it in another.

        Submissive women are not unconfident by any means…but the fact that submissive fantasies happen in women who are not otherwise submissive-that’s probably a “desire to be desired” thing. There are women who aren’t interested in submission outside of the bedroom, who do want submission only once in a while–that is probably indicative of a need to be desired. These women are different from women who want submission all the time. I was attempting to explain the fantasy–not the lifestyle.

        I won’t address your other statements because I simply don’t agree. People are individual…it’s not “men are this way, women are this way.” I have heard many people claim “all women are submissive,” and I just meant to state that women can be submissive in one aspect but not another.

        Again, I did not attend for a submissive-shaming tone. I probably should add an introduction explaining that. Anyway…good post. I’m embarassed how my article came across…that is absolutely not what I meant to convey.

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  2. @anarbitraryauthor: “I won’t address your other statements because I simply don’t agree. People are individual…it’s not “men are this way, women are this way.””

    That there are exceptions to the rule does not change the rule. I agree with you that people are varied but that doesn’t change what our general makeup is. We need to stop understanding ourselves and society by outliers. It makes no sense and leads to a mess of relativism.

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      1. It’s really not a slippery slope. What is a slippery slope is any requirement that all people must follow one rule. We can acknowledge that life in general is not “one size fits all” without abandoning logic and pretending that we are what we aren’t.

        Our general makeup, in this context, is natural gender roles. A part of what HR is talking about here.

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      2. @MargeryM, why is it their generalizations are a-ok, but any generalization that doesn’t conform with their group think is somehow bad?

        Oh who am I kidding, I know the answer.

        By the way, love your site, and I’m uber-jealous of your husband.

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      3. Without generalizations, thought and communication are impossible. Feminists generally have no problem with generalizations, if I were to say “women are just as smart as men” (which is factual) you wouldn’t have a problem with that generalization.

        Your article makes numerous generalizations about women in general and submissive women in particular, so why are your generalizations ok but others aren’t?

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      4. @Hipster Racist

        I did use generalizations-but I amended my statements. Generalizations are okay for starting points, as long as we go on to recognize individuals.

        “Women are as smart as men”-generally true, and generally doesn’t have any negative consequences.

        “Usually women are somewhat submissive-” generally true, but may have bad consequences (A man assuming, for example, that if a woman doesn’t do what he says without an explanation, she doesn’t love him.) That’s why the importance of individuals/ individual experience needs to be stressed.

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      5. It could very well have negative consequences, a man might assume a woman is as smart as him in a dangerous situation when she isn’t. That would be far worse than some romantic complications.

        “A man assuming, for example, that if a woman doesn’t do what he says without an explanation, she doesn’t love him.”

        The humor of this scenario is the idea that a) men expect women to do what they say and b) would think if she doesn’t she doesn’t love him. This sort of dynamic does not exist in the actual real world of the modern USA. It’s only in the feminist alternate universe where the bad old 1950s are still the norm (even though the 1950s weren’t like the feminist imagination either.)

        Of course, smart women know that submitting to a man is a way to his heart.

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  3. I see you have a link to loving domestic discipline below. Now you are getting controversial. It shall be interesting to see what you write on that.

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    1. Some men love being in the military. The structure, the rules, the clear lines of authority appeal to them. They like having a duty to perform and have their work judged by an authority figure. Tattoos and piercing can be prosecuted under the UCMJ for “damaging government property.” No one has a problem with that. Women submit to male bosses – for a paycheck – all the time. No one has a problem with that.

      But if a submissive woman wants to submit to the authority of the love of her life, her most intimate, life long partner, feminist harpies will start shrieking. Because feminists hate nothing more than a happy submissive women.

      Feminism is a hate ideology, full stop.

      I disagree with the author “Whisper” that Christian Domestic Discipline is “just” an excuse for BDSM, although clearly for a lot of women it’s very erotic. I’ve read that boys and girls cry at the same rate until about 8 or so; clearly “society” trains boys to control their emotions more, while women crying is seen as no big deal. Women go through monthly hormonal cycles where their emotions can go from one extreme to another, without them being able to control it. A man that literally grabs his woman, spanks her until she cries, dries her tears etc. – that can be very emotionally cathartic for some women.

      Seriously, if feminists don’t like it, fine, they can have their vibrators, cats, and lesbianism. Just leave the rest of us alone.

      Like

    2. You see, Ryu, this is why the topic is so interesting. Outside of a relationship, BDSM is just a fetish, a kink. Inside a monogamous, long term, committed relationship, it’s a lot more (for many people) than “just” sex.

      Spanking your wife used to be relatively common place in America. Before the 1960s, a spanking scene in a movie was not unusual at all, it was considered sexy and/or funny.

      Well, spanking your wife became practically illegal, termed as “abuse.” Most men won’t do it even if their women ask them, even if they beg! That’s how demasculinized and timid men have become.

      I know of a dom that has women flying from out of state just because he’ll top them and they can’t find it anywhere else.

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  4. @Hipster Racist
    Very true. ‘Twere just examples. Of course situations very and any generalization *could* have a negative consequence.

    Submission is certainly the way to many men’s hearts. Not all, but many. Hey, as long as you acknowledge that not all women or men behave in the same way-and you have-then I really have no problem. It’s just that so many people will take a generalization and become outraged and confused when not everyone fits into their “man” or “woman” box. But that’s clearly not you, so I’m going to leave you alone now. 🙂 Looking forward to your discipline post, if you decide to write it. Thanks for the discussion, you’ve really given me a lot to think about!

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    1. @AA,

      Just to be clear, I am only talking about submission in the terms of a long term, adult, committed relationship like marriage, where both people want that kind of relationship and where the couple will be raising children and staying with each other “till death do us part.”

      I definitely don’t think that women are, or should be, expected to submit to a boyfriend, or a guy she’s dating, or anything like that, or if she’s just not the type. I don’t think most men would expect that either, they would be crazy to.

      I also endorse abstinence for anyone under 18.

      I probably misread your article, there’s nothing in it I object to.

      Like

    1. @POL

      “Hipster racism” is a complicated topic believe it or not. My use of the term is sort of a “tongue in cheek” joke at the expense of the politically correct types.

      Glad you like the comments, I found your blog quite interesting and your husband sounds like a lucky man!

      Like

  5. What bothers me about feminists is the excessive amount of attention they pay to the relationships of other women. For the most part, I don’t care what’s happening in other people’s relationships. Why should they?

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    1. @SSS

      Yes, it’s interesting isn’t it? They preach tolerance while being intolerant. They say “live and let live” but they don’t. They demand tolerance yet show no tolerance. They demand everyone’s choices be respected – except for the choices they don’t like.

      And they sure love to stick their noses in other people’s business, don’t they?

      Like

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